[00:19:48]
TheFatherMind
Oh login you opened a can of worms there... here is the story...
[00:23:37]
login
you wanted to be a father?
[00:24:41]
TheFatherMind
Well I am one.. but there is no relation. I have over 10 children now.
[00:24:45]
TheFatherMind
Many MANY years ago (Once upon a time in the 1990's..) I founded a mentoring group called "The Place of Dangerous Minds".. In the group the Mentors, or Admins, were referred to as "Masters". And so my nickname eventually became "Master Of Masters". It was a cool nick.. but it felt a bit egotistical to me honestly.
[00:25:20]
TheFatherMind
The one I had before that was MasterMerlin and I hated that there are hundreds of MasterMerlin's on the net. Well one of the drawbacks to this new nick, "MasterOfMasters" was that in IRC.. when people referred to me they would us the Acronym for "Master Of Masters"... "MOM".
[00:25:41]
TheFatherMind
I complained regularly about that.. and one day outright said to someone... "I am not your f*cking Mother".. And this cute little German boy said... "No... you are our Father.. you are The Father Mind!" A light went off in my head..
[00:26:13]
TheFatherMind
Searched Yahoo for the nick (Google did not exist yet) and found no one had ever used that nick.. and so I agreed with him. Then a short time later someone made me my avtar you can see here: https://TheFatherMind.com
[00:28:21]
TheFatherMind
I have a picture of myself and my wife on that page also.
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login
Have you registered TheFatherMind as an international trademark?
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login
It doesn't cost much if you use the Madrid Convention
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login
Your wife is TheMotherMind then?
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TheFatherMind
Heh.. never even considered that. I should do that.
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login
The second one or the trademark?
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login
You have a logo on your home page too
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login
Maybe add a description of it as well
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login
i don't have your basic auth credentials, so did not see your wife and you on that page
[00:39:15]
TheFatherMind
No, my wife goes by "TheMotherOfFire" and also, mostly, "BonnieLass30"
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TheFatherMind
Login to that is "noob" and "fuckfuckfuck"
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login
nice phogto
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login
10 kids would mean more than one woman, right?
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login
Otherwise it would take 30 years, assuming a cap of 2 years in between
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TheFatherMind
Correct.. 3 women with 3 daughters.. 2 of which has 8+ children between them.
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login
So, is the number of children more than the number of sex partners?
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caurn
.''. *''* :_\/_: .
[09:23:10]
caurn
:_\/_: . .:.*_\/_* : /\ : .'.:.'.
[09:23:12]
caurn
.''.: /\ : _\(/_ ':'* /\ * : '..'. -=:o:=-
[09:23:14]
caurn
:_\/_:'.:::. /)\*''* .|.* '.\'/.'_\(/_'.':'.'
[09:23:16]
caurn
: /\ : ::::: '*_\/_* | | -= o =- /)\ ' *
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caurn
'..' ':::' * /\ * |'| .'/.\'. '._____
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caurn
* __*..* | | : |. |' .---"|
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caurn
_* .-' '-. | | .--'| || | _| |
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caurn
.-'| _.| | || '-__ | | | || |
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caurn
|' | |. | || | | | | || |
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caurn
___| '-' ' "" '-' '-.' '` |____
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caurn
ɪʀᴄ.ꜱᴜᴘᴇʀɴᴇᴛꜱ.ᴏʀɢ #ꜱᴜᴘᴇʀʙᴏᴡʟ
[09:23:34]
caurn
"isn't it beautiful?"
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login
TheFatherMind: maybe you bought bitcoin early
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login
to be able to raise 10 children well
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[TechNet]
set mode +ao Icedream Icedream
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gaawg
.''. *''* :_\/_: .
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gaawg
:_\/_: . .:.*_\/_* : /\ : .'.:.'.
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gaawg
.''.: /\ : _\(/_ ':'* /\ * : '..'. -=:o:=-
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gaawg
:_\/_:'.:::. /)\*''* .|.* '.\'/.'_\(/_'.':'.'
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gaawg
: /\ : ::::: '*_\/_* | | -= o =- /)\ ' *
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gaawg
'..' ':::' * /\ * |'| .'/.\'. '._____
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gaawg
* __*..* | | : |. |' .---"|
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gaawg
_* .-' '-. | | .--'| || | _| |
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gaawg
.-'| _.| | || '-__ | | | || |
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\g
this network is blowjobs
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set mode +qo Amiga600 Amiga600
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set mode +qo Amiga600 Amiga600
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Dragon
that got his attention!
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\g
punches ComputerTech
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\g
punches ComputerTech
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\g
punches ComputerTech
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Dragon
slaps ComputerTech's bottom and grins cheekily
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Dragon
this rslap command is risky
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\g
how's mom ct
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\g
tell her i said hi
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\g
back to work
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ComputerTech
stares at Dragon for the slap
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Dragon
it was supposed to be violent not sexual I promise
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Dragon
so ComputerTech when are you learning rust??
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Dragon
ye u heard me
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Dragon
python is ez street
[19:37:47]
TheFatherMind
login I did not raise any of those children. 3 are direct decedents and the others are grand children. And as to my body count.. I have no idea.. More than I can remember.
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login
TheFatherMind: not body count but progeny count
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login
If you had 1 each with 3 women, the fertility ratio is 0.75*2
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login
Because you need 4 kids for four parents
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[22:25:12]
login
you know, the retirement system is dependent on exponential population growth
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login
if that fails to hold, the wealth will fail to buy i.e. price of retirement care will grow faster than GDP
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login
You'll have to be okay with imported service/care labour
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login
so everyone reproducing below population replacement rate will have extra money saved over to bid on their peers' kids to care for them in old age
[22:37:24]
login
While the peers who are having kids will spend a lot of time and money raising those kids, but then will have less money left over to bid on their own kids to care of them
[22:37:42]
login
And the kids will have to choose between foregoing money and fulfiling any obligations they feel towards their parents
[22:38:03]
TheFatherMind
login.. I am afraid to do that DNA thing. I also do not know where my father is. I know his name and that is all. And I am afraid of finding a bunch of relatives I do not want to know.
[22:38:05]
login
or, taking the money and serving the not-enough-children moneyed
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login
i.e., the parents who did the right thing get screwed in old age
[22:38:36]
login
The solution is either (1) taking wealth away from old people now and putting it in the hands of parents
[22:38:54]
login
(2) a long-term loan for parenting expenses to be paid off by the kid in their adult working life
[22:39:23]
login
(2) is similar to (1) except it uses money supply inflation instead of a transfer
[22:39:49]
login
or (3) taxing non-parents and subsidising parents
[22:40:32]
login
the non-parents may pay their 'children's welfare tax' by asking their own parents, i.e., old people, for a handout
[22:41:04]
login
TheFatherMind: if you become wealthy through some insanely lucky investment, you may find some more kids asking for support
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login
they may be your lost sibling's kids rather than your own, too
[22:41:28]
login
*lost siblings'
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TheFatherMind
Yeah, all my assets are going into trusts.
[22:41:56]
login
Do you think all your DNA descendents should get a piece of that trust?
[22:42:33]
TheFatherMind
One of my daughters keeps popping out kids and always asking me to give and buy her stuff. I never do.
[22:43:15]
login
Your daughter is saving the world
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login
But you know the game
[22:43:40]
TheFatherMind
No, I do not agree. She is raising little terrorists
[22:43:45]
login
Her peers who go childless or below-replacement-rate and invest that money
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login
will bid for her children to care of them over her in their old age
[22:44:33]
login
And, if you fund your daughter's children, you're subsiding the retirement of the childless
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login
i.e., all the childless peers of your daughter are screwing you and partying
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login
while you and your daughter are funding their retirement care through your daughter's children
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login
Isn't it a shameful thing?
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login
No wonder people are so secretive about their number of sex partners, and whether they'll have children or not
[22:46:28]
login
It's taboo to ask or talk about either
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login
Same with money
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login
TheFatherMind: Why not put some performance plan for your daughter and her children
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login
and make payment contingent on hitting those targets
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login
i.e., good grades, you can write a test for what they should know and be able to do
[22:47:42]
login
and administer it to your grandchildren
[22:47:55]
TheFatherMind
That is okay. My wife and her family will get most of my assets.
[22:47:58]
login
Have them learn a musical instrument or to sing, or athletics etc.
[22:48:10]
TheFatherMind
She will be taking care of me in my old age anyhow. She is less than half my age.
[22:48:23]
login
She'll be needing some taking care of in her old age too
[22:48:43]
login
Is she spawning her caretakers?
[22:49:10]
login
or, if she's going to be asking someone else's kids to do that for her, will she be adding new progeny to make up for that to the pool of future workers?
[22:49:58]
login
The robots will get dexterous enough to satisfy your wife's care needs
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login
And the companies making those robots will probably have the highest enterprise value in history
[22:51:19]
login
If pregnancy is such an issue, commercial surrogacy is legal in the US
[22:52:00]
login
And I think in the future there will be a new profession - professional parenting
[22:52:29]
login
Current foster parents are not fit for purpose, but maybe there are some really skilled parenting experts
[22:52:42]
login
Of course, all of this costs money
[22:53:06]
login
And, a surrogate bearing your child means she isn't bearing her own in that 9-12 month period
[22:53:22]
login
so it's an opportunity cost to her to be your wife's surrogate
[22:53:59]
login
The same is true of nannies/professional parents, who would be spending time raising your wife's children instead of their own or someone else's
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login
TheFatherMind: maybe after you've lived a wonderful life and she's your current age, she can do a thing by finding someone half her age
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login
That young man will be taking care of her then, and he can find someone half his age when he's your age
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login
It works out as long as someone else is pumping out new people to marry generation after generation
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login
so it's the same problem
[22:56:22]
TheFatherMind
She will just go back home to her home country. Her family is large and not poor there. She will liquidate my assets and buy a house out there and be a landlord.
[22:57:18]
login
Eventually, your wife's new husband's new wife will have to settle for an african or peruvian husband
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login
Her family = parents and siblings or children and siblings' children?
[22:58:47]
login
The main question is, who will build the house and who will rent the house when there just aren't enough people to build the house this year or enough rental demand
[22:59:06]
login
She may have to pay an exhorbitant price for the house to be built in a reasonable timeframe
[22:59:18]
login
unless it'll be robot built
[23:00:06]
login
Maybe instead of a house she'll have to buy a part of a datacentre and earn rent from AIs hiring computational resources from that datacentre
[23:00:49]
login
Or buy the stock of the robot company to earn some dividends from it
[23:01:20]
login
to then pay the robots of that very company to do services for her
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login
like giving her a haircut or cleaning the house
[23:02:21]
login
Or, if we're talking futuristic, it'll be a crypto token that gives her a discount on the robot's usual rate
[23:02:47]
TheFatherMind
Population and employees is not an issue in Indonesia
[23:03:02]
TheFatherMind
There is not a population problem. There will not be one.
[23:03:28]
login
But aren't there Indonesian women such as your wife who want no children?
[23:03:30]
TheFatherMind
For as long as I have been alive they have been threatening us with population issues.. and it has never even come close to happening.
[23:03:49]
login
There will be more as Indonesian women start outearning Indonesian men
[23:03:55]
TheFatherMind
If more than half the people have more than one.. solved. And it is factual that this is the case.
[23:04:11]
login
The threat was never in the 'there won't be enough'
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login
directino
[23:04:34]
login
It was more in the 'there will be too many to feed' direction, which never came to pass because of the green revolution and fertilisers
[23:04:42]
TheFatherMind
They also have very good and inexpensive healthcare there. She is covered.
[23:05:03]
login
The food is not the problem
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login
It's that if the population starts declining, there will be fewer doctors and teachers
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login
so the quality of the people left over will decline too
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login
if one were to extrapolate to the population being the same as in historical times, there will be such few people that all technological process will be 'lost knowledge'
[23:06:35]
login
More than half the people need to have more than 2 for it to be solved
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login
to make up for the ones having 0-1
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login
Half the people = men, the other half = women
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login
If you want more than half the people to have children, some men will have to start giving birth
[23:07:39]
login
i.e., all the women will have to have 2, or some will have to have 3 for others to have less than 2
[23:08:01]
login
And, research has found that one needs to have 5 for the family line to still be around 100 years later
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login
just because of the historical prevalence of those who want 0-1 child
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login
I have asked every woman around me semi-casually what their plan for children is
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login
The answer I get is, "my husband and i have decided to have no children"
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login
or "i will be happy with my babies, i.e., cats"
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login
or "i haven't thought about that"
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Dragon
good, there are too many people.
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login
It's like saying the GDP is too high
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login
Or 'the world is too comfortable'
[23:11:20]
login
The only reason it feels like there are too many people is because extracting resources from ores isn't economical enough due to energy constraints on purification of bad-quality ores
[23:11:41]
login
We've solved the issue in food by converting nitrogen in the atmosphere into fertiliser
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login
i.e., urea
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login
The natural version would be the nitrogen cycle, but we've been able to increase the rate of nitrogen fixation using energy
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login
It's the same with water purification using desalination plants
[23:13:10]
login
The only missing piece is capturing the sun's energy over a wider area and buffering it for 24-48 hours using a battery or other method
[23:13:26]
login
Maybe even intercontinental HVDC lines just like internet submarine cables
[23:14:01]
login
That way, the sunlit part of the Earth can transmit power to the dark part
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login
Cheap energy will make all the other cycles fast enough to not be an impediment to human population growth
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login
The ultimate source of energy, actually entropy, is the sun
[23:15:26]
login
New material gets deposited to the Earth via meteorites, but otherwise it's just all recycled via natural and artificial processes
[23:15:58]
Dragon
it feels like there are too many people because there are
[23:16:07]
Dragon
you know how many hours I need to drive to hike without someone else?
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login
isn't that because cities are densely populated?
[23:16:33]
Dragon
which is bad for disease isn't it?
[23:16:37]
Dragon
are you arguing for *more* people? lol
[23:17:10]
login
more people = more brains instead of soil + plants
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login
i'd say that's a positive
[23:17:35]
login
Maybe some of them will make life even more comfortable
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login
Or be very entertaining
[23:19:00]
login
Fewer people is a danger because none of the economic models take that into account
[23:19:26]
login
Imagine chronic job shortages, accelerating increases in price
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login
higher taxation due to the erosion of the tax base (in absolute terms)
[23:20:03]
login
Just a winding back of extreme human talent and skill
[23:20:36]
login
Slower athletes, fewer new movie stars, fewer of everything
[23:21:00]
login
House prices will crash
[23:21:14]
login
Abandoned towns
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login
Crumbling infrastucture, because who wants to be pouring concrete and doing construction
[23:21:57]
login
The US is already facing a mild version of this
[23:22:19]
login
I'd be pretty sad to see the pinnacle of human endeavour behind us
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login
And you know, it's Africa, Israel and Afghanistan that is having a lot of kids
[23:22:57]
login
So they'll be moving into the now emptier cities
[23:23:22]
login
i.e., Western culture will be dead and fundamentalist culture will take over
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login
Unless you can convince the Afghan, African and Israeli kids to give their own culture up and adopt Western culture
[23:23:59]
login
At which point their fertility rate will start going down too
[23:24:33]
login
There must be a way to have a liberal culture but also not below-replacement fertility
[23:24:44]
login
Or maybe liberal people have conservative parents
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login
because liberal parents don't have children
[23:25:15]
login
So Western culture will have to regenerate itself in the children of fundamentalists
[23:25:37]
login
Another alternative is that cloning will be liberalised
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login
And people will just clone themselves in a pod or something
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login
And raise their cloned children to take over their role
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login
a billionaire will have 1000x the clones of a millionaire (just going by linear ratio of net worth
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login
a real power-law distribution of genes instead of the current natural mixing
[23:27:05]
login
A Children-of-Men scenario
[23:27:20]
login
(the movie)