[00:06:18]
fridurk
the reason shit doesn't work on my new hp laptop is because microsoft is sabotaging their competition
[00:06:21]
fridurk
fucking. assholes.
[00:06:34]
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brothchild
i can't even hear my laptop fan run up doing image-gen
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fridurk
you leave your laptop in bed when you touch your peepee don't you
[00:07:32]
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mlu
it short circuited
[00:07:46]
fridurk
that would explain a lot
[00:07:53]
fridurk
if you were more specific
[00:15:09]
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brothchild
what specific thing interests you
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fridurk
my linux mint is pretending to not be debian
[00:17:50]
fridurk
but linux mint are their pronouns i guess
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brothchild
that's a valid analogy - people are misled to apply branding to themselves now, as their identity, when their true identity is their geneetic tree
[00:19:31]
fridurk
wow i wonder if that's deep
[00:19:52]
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brothchild
probably deeper than you've thought before yes
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fridurk
anyway, yes hp laptop no mic, and i'm seeing people say a workaround is external webcam with microphone
[00:22:27]
fridurk
this is one of those things where i'm pretty sure i know who's fault that one is and it's microsoft's
[00:23:16]
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brothchild
somebody always needs to write the linux driver, and those people usually want to get paid
[00:23:38]
+
brothchild
that was rough times back in the 90s
[00:27:09]
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brothchild
dmesg and lsusb can get you the product id sometimes to look up driver info
[00:29:51]
fridurk
i don't believe that
[00:31:14]
fridurk
linux doesn't work on windows anymore does it
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Shahid
lolling
verity
verity
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lolling
verity
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glitchy
set mode -v truthwillout
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verity
verity
lolling
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fridurk
yeah don't need an OS helping the user sometimes and sometimes not helping the user
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lolling
verity
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@
glitchy
[url] fal/flux-2-klein-4B-outpaint-lora · Hugging Face | huggingface.co
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Shahid_
is now known as Shahid
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brothchild
being able to do this shit is awesome even if it takes minutes
[00:50:15]
+
brothchild
i might even fire up the big box for it
[00:51:12]
fridurk
i'm actually literally a fan of hunger? makes future food tastier
[00:51:22]
fridurk
it's literally not a negative
[00:51:44]
fridurk
until you start dying i guess but that's multiple hours ahead of time
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zer0s
zer0s
zer0s
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joined #linux
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brothchild
it's good to go without food for a while
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hoice
hoice
hoice
hoice
hoice
[00:59:42]
fridurk
no i remember once i actually gained enough weight where when i tried to lose it i absolutely could not, skinny my whole life until after college
[00:59:54]
fridurk
then handy motorcycle crash solved that
[01:00:07]
fridurk
icu resident for awhile
[01:00:22]
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brothchild
yeah appreciate the silver linings when you can
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Elon_Musk
Elon_Musk
Elon_Musk
Elon_Musk
Elon_Musk
Elon_Musk
STAR_LINK
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brothchild
still some things to fix tho
[01:08:14]
fridurk
why does everything work sometimes
[01:09:32]
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glitchy
set mode +v zer0s
[01:11:19]
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zer0s
interesting brothchild
[01:11:41]
+
brothchild
yeah i'm making the world's best TUI font
[01:12:04]
+
brothchild
the only competition is yesterday's me
[01:12:25]
+
zer0s
the worlds best tui font XD
[01:12:35]
+
zer0s
brothchild: are you a TUI guy?
[01:13:15]
+
brothchild
from before my computer had graphics capability
[01:13:52]
+
zer0s
well, to be fair, I hated using computers when it was tui only but I was probably too young for it
[01:13:59]
+
zer0s
I enjoy it now
[01:14:11]
+
brothchild
hm well i liked makin things move on the screen. still do.
[01:14:25]
+
brothchild
have you seen some of the PETSCII games made recently
[01:14:43]
+
brothchild
well some mad lads did it, made decent action games with text
[01:14:47]
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[01:14:51]
+
brothchild
one was by dr terrorz, forgot the name of it
[01:15:04]
+
brothchild
the other is "Attack of the PETSCII Robots" which is a brilliant execution
[01:15:27]
+
brothchild
Ah 'Digiloi' is the other one
[01:16:08]
+
zer0s
interesting
[01:16:18]
+
zer0s
the commodore version was impressive
[01:16:55]
+
brothchild
that is so much better than anything done in 1980s, with the same character set and hardware
[01:17:13]
+
brothchild
stuff like that is cool, taking 40 year old hardware furthur
[01:17:32]
+
zer0s
agreed
[01:17:41]
+
zer0s
love that these guys are pushing the hardware
[01:18:41]
+
brothchild
almost tempted to get twitter to give a thumbs-up to such people but i just can't do it
[01:19:01]
+
zer0s
do you never open an x instance?
[01:19:19]
+
brothchild
i sometimes open a mirror to check what people send me
[01:20:09]
+
zer0s
I'll just copy the link using tmux and view in fbi lol
[01:20:25]
+
zer0s
curl ->fbi
[01:20:47]
+
zer0s
but with twitter... I'm sure someone has created a tui for that
[01:22:03]
+
zer0s
I don't mind starting windowmaker/firefox.
[01:22:18]
+
zer0s
but its not a good use of resources on this computer
[01:23:26]
+
zer0s
is it?
[01:23:40]
+
brothchild
zer0s: there was an experimental framebuffer console that finally supported utf-8 a while back but it got dropped
[01:24:02]
+
zer0s
eh, I'm fine with tty as is
[01:24:03]
+
brothchild
but since we can draw straight to framebuffer, no reason not to write a userspace console app that just renders like fbi does
[01:24:26]
+
brothchild
i am not satisfied since i can't use my awesome terminal font in current kernel framebuffer
[01:24:36]
+
brothchild
it limited to 8-bit characters (ascii)
[01:24:48]
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zer0s
be happy with it XD
[01:24:50]
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glitchy
glitchy
[01:24:57]
+
zer0s
sometimes 8 bits is enough
[01:25:03]
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brothchild
i am happy but i could be happier
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zer0s
remembers a famous line about 256kb being all the memory someone would ever need
[01:25:32]
+
brothchild
you think ram is expensive now, try 1981
[01:25:40]
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zer0s
yeah i'm sure
[01:25:45]
+
zer0s
we're all just spoiled
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devbox
set mode +o glitchy
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zer0s
but the applications keep becoming more hungry
[01:26:06]
+
brothchild
well now we can do new things with lots of ram, so there's kind of a reason now
[01:26:23]
+
brothchild
the webbrowser is just cancer though really a catastrophe i saw coming ages ago
[01:26:27]
+
zer0s
there's also this ethos that unused ram is wasted ram
[01:26:45]
+
brothchild
also comes from the browser people
[01:27:10]
+
zer0s
to be fair, the webbrowser is what most people interact with the most on a computer
[01:27:19]
+
zer0s
I think a terminal would put off most
[01:28:04]
+
zer0s
I just see firefox use 1gb of ram on one tab, and my brain melts
[01:28:53]
+
brothchild
i makes me want to get ze flammenwerfer
[01:29:14]
+
brothchild
using a supercomputer performance and ram to display a page of text and images
[01:29:35]
+
brothchild
i will not share further thoughts on this matter
[01:29:47]
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zer0s
lol its true
[01:30:01]
+
zer0s
but its more like people using supercomputers to watch cat videos
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Phoenix
Phoenix
[01:30:58]
+
zer0s
I blame newer languages for being wasteful with memory. Python is very guilty
[01:31:49]
+
brothchild
it's understandable that people care less about RAM now, but not that much less. that's degeneracy
[01:32:23]
+
brothchild
also i want top/htop/btop to group the damn process spam for firefox and other multithreaded apps
[01:32:25]
+
zer0s
people just don't care about minimizing ram use anymore
[01:32:28]
+
brothchild
that should have been done long ago
[01:33:24]
+
brothchild
look at your process table, it's all firefox spam or brave spam
[01:33:28]
+
zer0s
I love btop but it feels indulgent compared to top
[01:33:44]
+
brothchild
btop helps my eyes find what i want to see
[01:33:53]
+
brothchild
it's practically better in that way
[01:33:57]
+
zer0s
agreed, that makes it worth it for me
[01:34:15]
+
brothchild
sometimes it crashes though, when i get memory pressure
[01:34:44]
+
zer0s
what are you running on where btop crashes lol
[01:35:15]
+
zer0s
I thought you were a tui guy
[01:35:39]
+
brothchild
i like TUIs i'm not manaical about it
[01:35:55]
+
brothchild
did you see my bash image editor
[01:36:23]
+
zer0s
I didn't
[01:36:42]
+
zer0s
after I get off work, I get on this computer which is 100% tui
[01:38:53]
+
brothchild
my editor has grown to the point where i'm getting lost working on it
[01:39:47]
+
zer0s
that looks really nice
[01:40:11]
+
zer0s
i'm sure someone in 1980 wishes they could experience it
[01:40:43]
+
zer0s
I can't imagine having to paint or edit an image with a keyboard
[01:40:55]
+
zer0s
obviously people did it...but it sounds painful
[01:41:06]
+
zer0s
ah nice
[01:41:14]
+
brothchild
mouse works over ssh too :P
[01:41:27]
+
zer0s
ssh is goated
[01:41:40]
+
brothchild
not many neat terminal UI programs use it
[01:41:58]
+
zer0s
eh I technically use it to stream music from my server
[01:42:20]
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zer0s
mount the music folder from my server to a local folder using sshfs
[01:42:56]
+
zer0s
and then play file using sox or mpg123
[01:43:15]
+
zer0s
or you can be wasteful and use moc
[01:43:29]
+
zer0s
I literally only have 512mb of ram on this machine so I can't be wasteful
[01:43:30]
+
brothchild
i've thought of a way to stream low-res music, just using color info as pseudo sideband
[01:43:43]
+
zer0s
I stream flac files
[01:43:57]
+
zer0s
cpu usage hovers around 2%. totally doable
[01:44:17]
+
brothchild
well imagine a bbs where the beeps or music is streamed as low-bit color info overlaid on whatever your current screen is
[01:45:23]
+
zer0s
sounds trippy
[01:46:53]
+
brothchild
colorwise it'd be a slight overlay of noise, like old tv signal :P
[01:47:19]
+
brothchild
just pipe the stream, tee it to a seperate program that interprets the ECMA-48 color codes
[01:47:43]
+
brothchild
i calculate 12kbit/s would be doable - enough for opus audio
[01:47:57]
+
zer0s
12kbits/s
[01:48:06]
+
zer0s
just play midi files
[01:48:44]
+
brothchild
I can't warm up to midi, not enough control
[01:50:07]
+
zer0s
its what sounds more sane to me though
[01:51:07]
+
brothchild
some bbs's support that kind of note-data sending
[01:51:11]
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+
brothchild
and the cute thing is if i understand things right, it's possible to do the 'tee' to a seperate program that just decodes the audio, and use your normal ssh program for the control and text
[01:53:33]
+
zer0s
I've honestly never used a bbs, so I don't know what the limits are here
[01:53:38]
+
zer0s
predates me
[01:54:19]
+
brothchild
have you seen the telnet map project i inspired? telnet mapscii.me
[01:54:44]
+
brothchild
i still don't understand how he's handling the mouse
[01:55:24]
+
zer0s
mapscii.me is inspired
[01:55:50]
+
brothchild
rastapasta did the hard work though
[01:56:14]
+
brothchild
he used to hang out in irc
[01:56:32]
+
zer0s
ah no more?
[01:56:40]
+
brothchild
havent seen him in 15 years
[02:04:45]
+
brothchild
two things reapered friends of mine - cabal killing mobile linux (maemo) and cabal's remote code injections 2021
[02:06:25]
+
zer0s
glitchy: what are these references?
[02:06:36]
+
brothchild
The cognitive dissonance of security-focused computer experts just rolling over and rolling up their sleeves was a.. . . .
[02:06:39]
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zer0s
I don't remember maemo
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@
glitchy
zer0s: brothchild: MS/Nokia cabal axed Maemo (N900's OG Linux phone OS, <> 😏 killed ~2010 for WP)—IRC buds bailed; 2021 shady cabal RCE attacks rekt more homies, rastapasta ghosted way earlier 💀🐧
[02:07:14]
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zer0s
interesting
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brothchild
maemo was nokia's smartphone OS after symbian, kind of a skunkworks project
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zer0s
symbian lol, what a blast from the past
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brothchild
i'd have championed it if it hadn't been locked down community-wise
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brothchild
derived from Psion's excellent Epoc OS
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brothchild
apps used a few kilobytes, modular loading code objects. did everything right.
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brothchild
near instant startup, where you left off
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zer0s
I recall nokia and microsoft killing everything they made or touched
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zer0s
during that time period
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brothchild
devices could run on aa batteries
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zer0s
yeah surprising that they chose ARM so early on, very ahead of their time
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truthwillout
truthwillout
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zer0s
the last iteration of symbian looks very similar to android back in the day
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zer0s
I'm guessing it wasn't a good platform to keep building on so they scrapped it
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zer0s
well I guess it didn't matter that it wasn't good enough, they were dead in the water in terms of user adoption
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brothchild
symbian was on billions of phones
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zer0s
I think by the time nokia and microsoft joined, symbian was dead
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brothchild
microsoft came in tail end
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brothchild
nokia made symbian mainstream over several generations
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glitchy
[url] The Last Psion | Details | Hackaday.io | hackaday.io
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brothchild
i'd say Psion was the last great computer company
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brothchild
stamped out pioneering everything out of the raw ore
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zer0s
acorn/arm isn't a great english computer company?
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brothchild
yeah but psion was the last one
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zer0s
I don't know arm is eating x64's lunch right now
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zer0s
worthy accomplishment
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brothchild
well they're just an IP company now
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zer0s
they do the core arch that companies build on
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zer0s
very important
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zer0s
risc-V isn't going to be competitive for a while
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brothchild
i wouldn't mind a max m3 max's memory speed
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zer0s
I saw the licensing fees for ARM, I thought they'd be brutal, but its overblown
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zer0s
I think ARM is going to be relevant for a long time
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zer0s
I think the community hopes riscV will overtake it
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brothchild
maybe they could just build on canonical's GPU driver stack and open source that
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zer0s
I don't know what license their driver uses
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brothchild
well there was no driver for my amlogic sbc
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brothchild
until those freaks wrote a FOSS one
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brothchild
that is a happiest-day-ever project
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zer0s
these arm sbcs are problematic in that they will require blobs
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zer0s
no one wants to give up IP
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zer0s
even if it means everyone gains
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brothchild
last decent one was amlogic a311d
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brothchild
rockchip had something 'all ready for release' then a mysterious 18 month delay of pure silence
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brothchild
after which they re-announced one with a different gpu and ??? blobs
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brothchild
that has the stench of cabal so thick you could cut it with a knife
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zer0s
I used to be more curious about these alternative sbcs (outside of the raspberry foundation), but the support sucks
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zer0s
even nvidia's sbcs support sucks
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brothchild
hilariously i could sell my jetson nano for more than i paid for it
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zer0s
yeah if you can run anything
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brothchild
all kinds of fun things run on it as long as you don't install a browser
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zer0s
I think it goes beyond graphics issues
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zer0s
regardless, their willingness to just drop support after launch makes me not want to purchase lol
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brothchild
well browsers are too slow to display images and formatted text on a quadcore 2ghz 32-bit machine
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brothchild
when we could do it just fine at same resolution on a 25mhz 68040
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brothchild
we are in software purgatory
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zer0s
eh the world has moved on
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zer0s
this is why I just use lynx on this computer. I also only visit sites that require javascript enables
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zer0s
*enabled
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brothchild
that doesn't say anything about whether we're in a better or worse place now
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brothchild
lynx should use double size font for headers
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zer0s
I think its better with caveats
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brothchild
did you know that vt100 terminals can display double-size text?
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zer0s
brothchild: that would be nice
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brothchild
well you can't do it in console
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brothchild
how about a framebuffer xterm
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brothchild
that sounds like a thing this world needs
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brothchild
except drop that idiotic font rendrering
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zer0s
I've honestly stopped complaining about code I don't contribute to anymore lol
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zer0s
being a dev made me too sympathetic
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zer0s
*becoming
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brothchild
i will try to take your example
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woodwose
lynx should support some modern css
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brothchild
it's just rare that i get to talk to someone who understands the subjects i have particular dislikes in
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zer0s
lol, I get it
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zer0s
woodwose: that would be nice
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zer0s
I get the sense these aren't trivial tasks though
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zer0s
they take the aspects I hate about GUI programming and apply them to text
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zer0s
formatting is miserable work and no one respects it
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crocodundy
crocodundy
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brothchild
zer0s can you think of an algorithm to strip out the junk for lynx / w3m / links
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brothchild
i want junk removed and headers in doublesize text
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brothchild
oh did you see my .csv grapher for terminal?
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devbox
set mode +o Phoenix
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zer0s
well what do you mean by junk?
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brothchild
all the bits that waste vertical space like crazy in terminal
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brothchild
oh that cap doesn't have the double size text, moment
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zer0s
that graph looks nice :D
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zer0s
love that its coloured
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brothchild
but it's enough to get a visualization of your data as long as there's not too much
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zer0s
the problem with most of the graphs I used to need, they tended to require a z plane
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zer0s
I was dealing with heat equations at the time
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brothchild
hard to do without custom font like blapinus
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zer0s
still nice work
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zer0s
as for the vertical space waste, I'm afraid I don't see what you mean, but I could be too used to looking at lynx now
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brothchild
some sites have a column of links on the left and lynx (used to) display those first and waste a lot of space
[02:40:33]
Spookan
Good morning folks!
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woodwose
Spookan can't afford a stable connection, lol
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woodwose
he dcs and reconnects like a lil girl
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zer0s
very nice graphs brothchild
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zer0s
hi Spookan
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woodwose
he also doesn't run linux
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zer0s
brothchild: ooooh I know what you mean now
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zer0s
I totally forgot
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zer0s
you'd almost need to allow some sort of word wrapping to occur
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zer0s
I think their solution was probably a compromise which allows most websites (that aren't javascript restricted) to render correctly
[02:43:40]
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brothchild
i think it's a problem for a mathy + creative person, and those are rare
[02:44:04]
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zer0s
its not fixed, its still a problem
[02:44:23]
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zer0s
I just forgot about it/accepted it
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brothchild
what are reasons you prefer lynx to alternative console browsers?
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zer0s
I like the default color theming
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zer0s
also, the app is more intuitive to me
[02:46:07]
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zer0s
but most text browsers are fairly similar
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zer0s
I think the reason why more effort isn't put into these text based browsers now, is that more and more websites require javascript, so supporting a dying medium seems pointless
[02:49:32]
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zer0s
not that I don't think effort didn't go into making them what they are, I just suspect development isn't as active for that reason
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brothchild
mhm, same with dillo browser
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zer0s
exactly
[02:50:12]
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brothchild
there's just too much addon in web stuff, it's ... irredeemable
[02:50:35]
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brothchild
thankfully there's oldschool websearch sites too
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zer0s
we just have to appreciate old web while it lasts
[02:53:09]
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brothchild
i just picked up my water jug and it's empty again, like someone else drunk it
[02:53:24]
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brothchild
we lose our minds in bits and pieces it seems
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zer0s
lol good on you
[02:53:30]
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zer0s
for drinking that much water i mean
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brothchild
sometimes my only daily accomplishment is being hydrated
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brothchild
i'm impressed you do the discipline of console-only
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Neo_Nemesis
Neo_Nemesis
Neo_Nemesis
Neo_Nemesis
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zer0s
it honestly keeps me less distracted
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zer0s
its surprising how distracting pictures and videos are
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brothchild
my life is a sidequest fractal
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fridurk
a picture is worth a 1000 words
[02:57:56]
fridurk
so if it's video I don't understand anything
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brothchild
well now with qwen 3.5 EM you don't need to understand videos, your computer can
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zer0s
brothchild: mind if I ask what you do for a living? or at least general sector?
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brothchild
most of my work could be described as 'data janitor'
[03:02:19]
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brothchild
i got the chance to do more interesting things too though
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zer0s
nice :)
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brothchild
what can you say about your work?
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zer0s
I'm primarily backend, but I do fullstack
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brothchild
it nice to meet you and i have enjoyed the conversation
[03:06:14]
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zer0s
same :)
[03:06:57]
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brothchild
if you ever meet someone in desperate need of a graph in terminal send em my way
[03:07:38]
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zer0s
sure :)
[03:07:39]
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brothchild
i love drawin stuff with text blocks, it's like LEGO as a child
[03:07:50]
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brothchild
in fact the analogy is very good
[03:08:06]
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zer0s
i love ascii/text art
[03:08:51]
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zer0s
most of the stuff I try to do focuses on making these functional